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Post by Blodeuwen Hirashi on Jan 13, 2016 16:41:41 GMT
It would be nice to have an advantage to training with a mentor. Such training threads often take longer than simply training on one's own and it'd be cool to have some motivation to do it! I like the idea of training threads but fucking despise actually having to write them.
A suggestion would be to allow people to learn techniques a tier higher than their mastery allows as long as their trainer has the requisite mastery level to teach that? So if I (an AL with Spec Kido) were teaching some plebian HL/HL-A sub-shini with AA kido *cough* he could learn tier V and VI as opposed to just tier IV. Obviously this only works for tech masteries but those are the ones which are way more tedious IMHO.
That was an off-the-cuff suggestion- any better thought out mechanics for how to do it would be welcome!
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Post by yume on Jan 13, 2016 17:43:43 GMT
I mean, it isn't all that improbable, the only thing a mentor can give you lineage on is making things a bit easier to train for. I don't agree with giving you the ability to train above your tier level cause that would circumvent our mastery levels and rank guides... they are there for reasons beyond disabling from learning tier VII's back to back just so you can jump levels.
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Post by Mikhail on Jan 13, 2016 18:31:31 GMT
Though he does prove a point, honestly. Learning stuff on your own is more difficult than having someone that can actually help you. So, not saying you'll have extra tiers on it, but, in general, make it much more easier for someone being taught.
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Post by Blodeuwen Hirashi on Jan 13, 2016 23:09:49 GMT
What about limiting it to something like 1 tech per mentor per mastery level? Or just 1 tech per mastery level.
How alternatively how about, when you cash in an improvement thread where you've had a teacher, 1 tech of your mastery is allowed to count as double tech points for improving (and it gets a * next to it in the profile). But it only counts for that particular cash-in.
But yeah maybe those are a bit more complex.
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Post by Gaen on Feb 4, 2016 21:27:17 GMT
What if we went a much less complicated route with a different 'bonus' in that, after learning a technique of appropriate tier from their mentor, the person who learned it can claim a second technique of one tier lower in the field of their mentor.
EG:
Blod teaches Gaen a tier IV kido, and when requesting the profile change, I have that tier IV kido, and a 'bonus' tier III kido as a bonus for learning from a mentor.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2016 2:04:36 GMT
That one is pretty cool but what about when you get to tier VII? A free Tier VI is a little more than over powered isn't it? I have no alternate thoughts on a solution however...
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Post by Gaen on Feb 5, 2016 2:39:20 GMT
Well, the cap for the 'bonus' could be tier V or IV, but even at the point where somebody could learn a tier VII technique, tier VI techs aren't game changing.
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Post by Blodeuwen Hirashi on Feb 5, 2016 9:10:56 GMT
Gaen I think that's a good idea.
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Post by Mist on Feb 8, 2016 20:43:01 GMT
*Utilises necromancer powers to revive thread*
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Post by RIN MIYAGI on Feb 9, 2016 4:29:18 GMT
I also think Gaen's idea is a good one. Right now, having a mentor is basically only good for making grading less harsh, which let's be honest, isn't really a perk at all cause it's easy enough to pass those. Giving a character the ability to learn a second technique, albeit at a lower tier, would make it more plausible for members to look for other characters to teach them, which'll get threads going and plots started.
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Post by Pika on Feb 9, 2016 4:42:12 GMT
But dont you think the focus should be more on actually plotting with characters? Rather than getting an absolute plus 1?
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Post by Blodeuwen Hirashi on Feb 9, 2016 9:52:51 GMT
But Pika there are a million other ways to plot with characters. There are so many threads where I could plot with someone but learning techs is just mind-numbingly boring for both parties, and having a mentor stretches it out to be twice as long, basically. Ask Mist about poor old Raiden's kido training.
So basically people will still plot but in more exciting threads. Hell even a thread where both parties are watching paint dry and having a chat is less dull than training which just feels like work.
I just think that there should be some form of advantage from having someone teach you something because it's just way easier to learn shit when you have a teacher.
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Post by Mist on Feb 9, 2016 13:45:34 GMT
Well. Kido training can be interesting. I like the interaction. More or less.
Anyhow.
To go further on Gaen's idea, when you do grind Kido with a mentor, I mean, Raid has already learned two or three Kido from Blod. So, that entitles him to another two-three free spells? Just saying this can be abused.
So, I came up with the idea to limit the techs to maximum two free ones per thread.
Perhaps have a scaling. If you get four-five techs, you get three extra. etc.
But, just something I'm working out.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2016 14:49:01 GMT
How about training threads with a Master will allow you to gain PP and learn the techs if the master is at least two ranks higher or two mastery levels stronger.
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Post by Gaen on Feb 9, 2016 16:02:40 GMT
Plot Points could be a pretty elegant solution actually. Especially if the person who is hoping to be 'mentored' already has a host of kido/hakuda/rie techs and doesn't see a lower tiered bonus tech as an incentive.
How about the person gets half the purchase cost of the tech they've learned. It wouldn't require a cap, it isn't game changing, but it does provide a nice incentive.
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Post by RIN MIYAGI on Feb 9, 2016 17:51:47 GMT
I do like the plot points incentive as well. There's also the option of getting a price reduction of all future techs in that category your mentor trained you in. The reduction could vary at the mastery level of the mentor at the time you learned it, or it could be up to a certain tier of tech. The downside of this could be that there's a chance of so many techs getting a price reduction. Plus it's another thing for staff to keep track of.
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Post by Blodeuwen Hirashi on Feb 10, 2016 6:07:29 GMT
I think a permanent reduction in cost would be problematic simply because you then only benefit from training techs in a mastery once. Also effort to keep a track of blah blah blah.
A number of points equal to half the tech trained works really well. It'd be nice if you could pidgeonhole it to the mastery trained- but that would be a nightmare to keep track of (unless someone can think of an easy way? a "mastery specific point list" comes to mind but effort for staff)
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Post by Gaen on Feb 10, 2016 17:41:28 GMT
I feel like the simpler, the better. Training with a mentor gives you half of a techniques tier cost in plot points, and those plot points can be used however you want.
Now, for training Masteries, we can do something similar since each mastery level has a tier associated with it (Beginner = Tier I, Below Average = Tier II etc), and give half the plot points for a tech in the appropriate tier. Since Masteries (in theory) take more effort to train, it may take 2-3 threads to train it up enough for an upgrade. Again, plot points earned this way would be up to the player to choose how to spend.
I kind of like it this way since the Plot Points sort of represent the time and energy that you didn't waste by learning your new tech/skill from scratch, and instead having someone guide you. To me, thematically, it makes sense.
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Post by Blodeuwen Hirashi on Feb 11, 2016 6:51:44 GMT
Really good point there Gaen.
The mastery points you should only be able to cash when you actually get a mastery upgrade. And if you jump more than 1 mastery, then you only get it for the mastery you reach, not every mastery along the way.
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Post by Gaen on Feb 29, 2016 18:09:13 GMT
Um, can we get a confirmation as to whether or not staff has looked at/considered this topic?
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